1. religion and spirituality
2. christianity

Menlo Park Presbyterian Church
950 Santa Cruz Avenue, Menlo Park, CA 94025 650-323-8600
Series: The Main Thing
May 24, 2015
“Lesson from a Thousand Funerals”
Frank VanderZwan
Abby McHugh: Frank, it's so fun, such a treat for me to have the chance to sit down and talk with you.
For the couple of years I've been on staff here, I've just appreciated your friendship and the joy you bring
to our team and the laughter you bring. You've been at our church… How many years exactly has it been
now?
Frank VanderZwan: It has been 28 years, 28 long years for some people.
Abby: Yeah, I'm 28 years old.
Frank: I know. I was before you in a way.
Abby: That's amazing.
Frank: Yeah, that is incredible.
Abby: Frank, it is no secret that you are the guy who, time and time again, shows up for people in their
moments of greatest need. You've probably seen inside of more hospital rooms and more homes than
anybody around. We are just grateful for you and for the gift your pastoral presence has been to our
church and our community.
Frank: Thanks, Abby.
Abby: Yeah, absolutely. How many funeral services do you think you have done since the time you
arrived at our church? Actually, how many funeral services do you think you've done total?
Frank: It's hard to tell. Before I came here, I really didn't do that many, but since I arrived here, I would
guess a little over 3,000 services. That's a lot.
Abby: Wow. That's amazing.
Frank: It's amazing to me. I never would have thought when I arrived here that this would be one of the
primary things I would end up doing, but it's a real blessing. It's a real gift to be able to do it.
Abby: You have over 3,000 experiences doing funerals. Are there any that stick out to you as being more
memorable than others? Looking back, what strikes you as some that were different perhaps?
Frank: Every one is unique, but when you ask me that kind of a question, the first thing that comes to my
mind is the time I was asked to do a funeral for a family where the cremated remains were to be placed in
© Menlo Park Presbyterian Church, All Rights Reserved
For personal or small group use only. For other uses, please contact [email protected].
-1-
a full grave. A full grave is about six or seven feet deep. The container of cremated remains is very small.
The question was, "How do we get the container into the grave?" Guess how it happened, Abby.
Abby: I don't want to guess.
Frank: I had to go down into the grave and gently put the remains in the corner and then climb back out.
Abby: Okay. The things they don't teach you at seminary.
Frank: I know.
Abby: What's going through your mind when you're down there?
Frank: Well, the first thing I thought of was, "They didn't teach me this in seminary." It was just
something I had to do. It's one of those things where every service is unique, and everyone is different.
Everyone's needs are different, and everyone's responses are different.
Abby: I can only imagine. Over that many years and walking with people in this really tender, delicate,
sweet, hard time in their lives, what are some things you have been personally touched by, learnings you
have as a result of that experience?
Frank: I think over all of those years, there are so many things you end up picking up. I kind of think
your own spiritual life changes as a result of doing services and being involved with families at some of
the deepest points in their lives. It's really a phenomenal gift to be able to walk with folks through times of
crisis and pain and loss. You immediately enter into their lives.
You become a family member to a countless number of families. I think one of the first things I realized is
that for people, our view of death shapes our view of life. How we look at the end kind of marks how we
look at the beginning and what that all means. One of the things I can guarantee you is everyone is going
to face death. That's 100 percent.
There are not a lot of things I know totally, but that one I know totally. Death becomes part of the process
of life. Somewhere along the lines, I think we have to think about it. It's a hard thing for people to think
about. Nobody wants to think about it or talk about it, but the Bible sure has a couple of things to say
about it. I love Paul's comment in 2 Corinthians.
He makes this comment. "Though outwardly we are wasting away…" Just think about that statement.
"Though outwardly we are wasting away…" That's the process of death. "…yet inwardly we are being
renewed day by day." That's the process of life. "Though outwardly we are wasting away…" To me,
that's a reminder of what happens to me, what happens to my body. My wife tells me I make noise getting
in and out of my car now. That's a sign of my body wasting away.
Abby: Hey, I think I heard that on the way here today.
Frank: Yeah. See? Well, it doesn't always happen.
Abby: I didn't want to bring it up, but now that you mention it…
© Menlo Park Presbyterian Church, All Rights Reserved
For personal or small group use only. For other uses, please contact [email protected].
-2-
Frank: Thank you, Abby. I just thought I would do that myself. You know, that's part of the process that
is there for everyone, but then we have this choice about what happens inwardly. What happens inwardly
is that constant renewal by God. Paul caught that. Somehow, we have to think about what that process is.
We're going to face death, and our bodies continue to remind us that we're heading toward that.
What God does on the inside is just so much more important. You know, if we think there is nothing after
we die, then we can kind of live our lives any way we want. It seems to me there isn't a whole lot of
purpose or meaning. If we understand there is life after death, then we better get a sense of what that
should look like.
It seems to me that one of the things I've learned from walking with folks through death so often is the
importance of life. What we do if we understand the ending of the physical story of life, it changes how
we live our lives day to day. We realize there is a purpose and a reason for all of this.
Abby: I want to go back to something you said that I think is really important. Death is not something we
think about much. As a culture, it's not something we talk about much. There is a lot of unspoken fear
around that process and that moment. As you've been with people in what you've called this real sacred
space, what are some of the fears people have voiced in that time or the fears you've noticed in people?
Frank: Well, I think the first factor is we don't know a whole lot about death, so there is kind of a
darkness associated with it. We're not sure what it will all look like and what will happen. Sometimes, one
of the first things I will think of when I'm with families where death is inevitable… There are two
questions I always think you can ask.
The first one is, "Are you afraid?" Folks will usually say, "Yeah." It's unusual for people not to be afraid.
The next part of it is, "Are you afraid of the process of what is going to happen before you die, or are you
afraid of what is going to happen after you die?" The piece before death, we have lots of things in place to
help people walk through that, whether it be hospitals, doctors, nurses, technicians.
I can't help too much with that, but the other question is, "Are you afraid of what is going to happen
after?" That's one that we in the Christian community have a voice in. I think that's the most important
question anyway. The reality for folks is very often, you can walk the Christian walk your whole life.
Sometimes I've even seen even at the very end, people will kind of have a break.
In that final few days, sometimes people will really worry. "Am I really good enough? Is this going to
happen?" To me, that's kind of a misunderstanding of the grace of God because God through Jesus Christ
ensures that walk will take place into eternity for us.
Abby: You mentioned earlier that your father actually had that experience. He was a man of faith his
entire life, and a very strong, vibrant faith in Jesus, it sounds like. He got to those final moments and had
some panic and anxiety as he faced death. You mentioned there was one thing that kind of calmed his
spirit. Would you mind saying a little bit about that?
Frank: For sure. My father was a strong Christian his whole life. It was kind of surprising to us that in
that last week or so, he started panicking and wondering about what was going to happen to him,
wondering whether he had been such a sinner that he wasn't going to make it to heaven. My wife Judy
was with him in that last week of his life.
© Menlo Park Presbyterian Church, All Rights Reserved
For personal or small group use only. For other uses, please contact [email protected].
-3-
The one thing that was able to calm him was her singing. She would sing hymns to him, and the things
medication couldn't do in those moments, the Word of God and those hymns he had grown up with were
just something that calmed his spirit and his soul. Hymns like "Abide with Me," which was my father's
favorite hymn. Judy just singing that to him gave him a tremendous sense of peace.
It reminds me again that the gospel and the Word of God are crucial, even in those last minutes for us. It's
okay to doubt. It's okay. I think for my father too, it was all right to ask those questions and wonder at the
end. That's the human part of our life. It's all right. A lot of us have questions throughout our lives and
until the very end.
Abby: As you're saying that, I'm thinking back to my grandfather who passed away just a couple of years
ago. I had the chance to spend his last couple of days with him and sitting on his bed with him. I
remember he asked for Johnny Cash music. I guess what Johnny Cash couldn't do for him, he asked for
the Psalms. He asked if I would read him the Psalms. We did that. We read the Psalms and the book of
John, I think. It was just this sweet, sweet moment. I know you've talked a little bit about the power of the
Psalms for people.
Frank: Oh gosh. Yeah. I think particularly for some of our older folks, when they face death, there is a
phenomenal sense of comfort in the Psalms. I've come to realize that part of it is because the Psalms are
very raw. They're real emotion. They're authentic. There's nothing fake about them. The ones that are
written are written from a point of pain or hurt or wonder or anger.
I think at some level, that's how we resonate with all of that. I think of Psalm 23, which to me is probably
the most well-known psalm. If you have a group of people who aren't scripturally literate, as soon as I
start reading Psalm 23, you can watch them kind of nod. That's one of those psalms again that speaks to
God's role in our lives, in our lives now, in the transition from here to eternity, and then in eternity. It's
just a phenomenal thing.
Abby: I want to ask. We've talked a little bit now about Scripture and about comforting folks who have
had a lifelong relationship or who have some kind of relationship with God and comforting them in that
death is the continuation of that relationship, when we go to be with God eternally. What about the phone
calls you get or the situations where you show up on the scene, and there isn't that either belief or a
foundation in Jesus Christ? How do you navigate those moments, and how do you offer comfort to people
in those moments? What does that look like for you?
Frank: Abby, that's a really good question. It's probably one of the most difficult areas of all of this. The
first thing I always recognize is that I can't make any judgment calls on anyone. I'm so grateful that God
does that. I have no idea, and I'm happy that I don't have any idea. I don't have any idea about a lot of
things, but that's one I particularly don't.
Abby: Don't sell yourself short.
Frank: No, I know it. I understand it. I always figure, "That's up to God." In those situations, all I can do
is share with people what this relationship with Christ means to me. That's done with integrity. I can think
of a number of instances where I've walked into a situation where somebody didn't believe. There's one
that comes to my mind right now.
© Menlo Park Presbyterian Church, All Rights Reserved
For personal or small group use only. For other uses, please contact [email protected].
-4-
I got a call from a family who doesn't go to church. They don't go to our church. They don't go to any
church. The children of this lady called and asked if I could come and pay a visit. Their mother was dying,
and she was very distressed, very uncomfortable. I said, "Of course." It happened to be a number of
blocks from the church. I drove over in the afternoon, and the husband answered the door. I told him who
I was and what I came to do. He said, "Well, come on into the living room."
We talked. We chatted. I said, "I'd like to go in and see your wife." He said, "I don't think that's possible
right now because she's sleeping." I said, "Okay, I'll come back." I went back to the office. A little bit
later, I got a call from the daughter asking how everything went. I said, "Well, your father did a pretty
good job keeping me away from your mother." She said, "Well, we'll talk to him. Would you consider
coming back?" I said, "Of course, I would."
The next day, I actually went back. The kids were there with their dad. They let me into the house, walked
me down the hallway to the bedroom, ushered me into the bedroom, and closed the door. There I was with
this lady who I didn't know. I still remember her sitting in the corner. She was a really sweet lady. She had
been a professor. We got to talking. I introduced myself and told her a little bit about who I was and what
I did. I said the kids were kind of worried about her.
I asked the questions. I said, "What are you afraid of? Are you afraid of the process? Are you afraid of
what is going to happen after?" She said, "Well, I don't know what's going to happen after." I said, "Well,
would you like me to tell you?" I kind of shared a little bit of John 14 with her and did it in very plain,
simple language. In the course of a couple of minutes, she said, "I want that."
Abby: Tell us about John 14. I know you almost have it memorized.
Frank: John 14 is one of my absolute favorite passages. In it, Jesus is talking to his disciples about his
own death. He says, "Don't let your hearts be troubled." In my vernacular, "Hey, guys, don't worry."
"Don't let your hearts be troubled. Trust in God. Trust also in me. In my Father's house are many rooms. If
it weren't so, I would have told you. I'm going there to prepare a place for you. If I go and prepare a place,
I will come back and bring you with me that you also may be where I am."
I think that last phrase kind of got this lady. She accepted Christ. A little bit later, I got a call from the
daughter saying, "What happened with my mom?" I said, "What do you mean?" She said, "Mom is
different. She's so calm and so at peace." I said, "Your mom didn't tell you." She said, "No." I said, "Your
mom became a Christian this afternoon." "Whoa."
I think those kinds of moments are repeated time after time. Again, in that last moment, people who don't
know Christ have no hope. They get agitated, whether they are willing to admit it or not, but there is that
fear of death again that we talked about that is really there. Then it's the gospel that provides it. That line
where Jesus says, "When everything is ready, I'm going to come back and bring you with me that you may
be where I am," I think is one of the most incredible statements in Scripture about death.
For us, death can be very fearful. For most people, we're afraid. We don't know what to expect. Jesus says,
"Look." In your vernacular, "I've got this. I'm all over this. When everything is ready there, I'm going to
come back, and I'm going to get you." We don't walk through that dark valley of Psalm 23 by ourselves,
but we now have this image of Jesus putting his arm around us and taking us home.
© Menlo Park Presbyterian Church, All Rights Reserved
For personal or small group use only. For other uses, please contact [email protected].
-5-
If I could, there's this great example of a young girl who was in the hospital. The family called. She had
come to the end of her life. She was a teenager. She was on life support, and the parents called because
they needed to remove life support that day and knew she was going to die but wanted a pastor there to
pray with her. I came into the hospital room, and I still can remember it as if it were yesterday.
I was standing at the foot of the bed. The technicians removed the breathing tube, removed all the support,
all the tubes. Everything was gone. This little girl was lying there. The family was standing on one side of
the bed. I prayed, and then in my mind's eye, I saw John 14 come to life. The parents were hanging on to
this little girl, not wanting to let go, which is totally understandable, as a parent.
In my brain, I saw Jesus standing on the other side of that bed. He had his arms like this, ready to put them
underneath this little girl. In my brain, I hear Jesus saying, "It's okay. You take as long as you need, but
when you're ready, it's okay to let go. I have her. Just trust me. I have her." That's John 14. There was a
moment where the parents actually stepped back, and I could just see Jesus scooping this little girl up and
whisking her off to heaven.
I think that's the process of death. Jesus promises in John 14, "I'm going to come back. I'm going to bring
you with me so you may be where I am," but at some level, we have to believe that. When we believe it,
that takes some of the fear away.
Abby: Frank, I would love it if you would just be willing to share. I know a couple of years ago, almost
two years exactly now, your 6-year-old grandson Jacob actually died as a result of almost a lifelong battle
with cancer. I know there were a lot of folks in our church who kind of walked with you through that and
wept with you through that. I just wonder what that was like for you personally, having been the guy who
shows up for other people. What was it like to be in the room with someone who is your own who you
love so dearly and having to go through that? What did you learn? What did you struggle with?
Frank: Abby, I think the first thing you just kind of mentioned is that you can't do this alone. It's one of
the reasons why we need church. It's why we need each other. It's why we need Life Groups. It's why we
need to get connected. To try and handle death (let's just call it that) on your own is really remarkably
difficult. It's almost impossible. When you do it with community, you grow together as a community as
well.
The whole journey of Jacob… Jacob was diagnosed when he was 1 year old, and he died when he was 6
and a half. It was a long, arduous journey of doctor appointments and tests and medication and radiation
and just all kinds of stuff we wouldn't ever want to put on a little child. Our family chose from the very
beginning to share that. That wasn't some family secret deal. I just shared that with everybody who knew
me at the time.
What we found was that we were not alone. There were lots of other folks who had walked through this,
who had lost children. My constituency is a little bit older, so they had lost children 50 or 60 years ago. It
was still as fresh for them as it was for us. Seeing that these people managed and got through their lives
and were living their lives was kind of a great example to me that, "You can get through this."
I think the reality is you don't ever get over death. You don't get over the loss of somebody you love, but
you can get through it. The question then is, "How do you get through it?" You get through it with
community, with having other people around you. Now, not everyone said the right thing. People meant
well. Everybody meant well. Some people made kind of ludicrous comments.
© Menlo Park Presbyterian Church, All Rights Reserved
For personal or small group use only. For other uses, please contact [email protected].
-6-
We had more medical opportunities offered to us of different kinds of strange things. I understood where
all of that came from. It came from a caring, loving place. First of all, we came through it with a family,
with our church family. That's why I love our church. It has been years and years of walking through
various events. It isn't just me going through it, but it's you. It's somebody else. We do that together. That's
why we have church. I would say, "Hooray for church." We need it. God had a great idea. It was brilliant.
The actual event of Jacob's death… Let me just say that in the months leading up to when we were kind of
sure this was going to happen, I got scared about me. I got scared about the fact that I probably would get
really angry with God because I didn't understand it. I didn't get how a 1-year-old could get something as
horrible as brain cancer and watching him over all those years and constantly being filled with hope that
they had found something.
We prayed and prayed and prayed. Groups prayed. People prayed all over the world for Jacob. Guess
what. God still took him home. I was afraid that when he finally died, that I would get really angry with
God because I didn't understand any of this. The reality of it is I didn't. I still remember very well the day
he went to be with God. I wasn't angry that day, and I wasn't angry the next day. I kept thinking, "Okay,
this is going to happen," but it didn't.
In the moment of his death, the most poignant day of my life… Jacob and his mom and dad lived about 75
miles away from our home. In the morning, I called to check on my wife to see how she was doing. She
said, "Well, Jacob wants to talk to you." Jacob gets on the phone. We have a little discussion. I say, "How
are you feeling?" He says, "Well, I'm really tired and sleepy, Opa." He calls me Opa.
I said, "Well, it's going to be okay, son. I'm going to come and see you tomorrow." "Okay, well I hope you
have a good day at work today," is what he said. I talked to Judy again and then hung up the phone. A
couple of minutes later, she texted me. She said, "Jacob asked me to text you to tell you to come."
Obviously, an hour or so later, I got in my car and drove to him.
It was really strange because he obviously knew at some level that that was going to be the day. That
actually was the day he died. The house was inundated with people coming and going all day. Jacob was
in a hospital bed in the family room. To a lot of people who came in, he said, "Come lay down with me."
It was like he was a little guy who was saying goodbye to everybody.
Basically, at like 7:30 at night, I think that's when Jesus took him, but his body stayed, and it struggled,
and 7:30 to 11:30 that night was probably the most horrific time of my life. We were all on the bed with
him, my wife and our two other grandkids and his mom and dad. Then we realized at 11:30, that was his
final moment where he gasped.
I kept assuring my daughter all the way through the evening, "He's not here anymore, sweetheart. Jesus
already took him." I think Jesus took him at 7:30. He scooped his hands under Jacob and said, "Okay,
Jacob, it's time for you to come home." We just had to struggle through those next four hours. Again, even
today, I don't understand quite what those four hours were all about. It was complicated, and it was very,
very difficult.
Let me tell you Jacob had one last hurrah. A friend of mine… I don't know how many people have funeral
directors and cemeteries on their quick dial on their phones, but I do. One of my very good friends is a
funeral director, and he had promised to take care of things. I had called him earlier in the day and said, "I
© Menlo Park Presbyterian Church, All Rights Reserved
For personal or small group use only. For other uses, please contact [email protected].
-7-
don't expect you to drive all the way out here because it's going to happen tonight." He said, "No, I'm
going to come." I said, "Okay."
At 11:30, I called him and woke him up. He got dressed and got in his van and came over. My daughter's
big concern was, "Are they going to come in a hearse to pick him up?" I said, "No, sweetheart. They'll
come in an unmarked van. Nobody will know." She didn't want the whole neighborhood all upset. They
live in a cul-de-sac. At about 1:30 in the morning, the van shows up, and the funeral director comes in.
We take care of everything. We wrap Jacob, put him on a gurney, and took him outside.
I closed the door. The funeral director is out in the middle of the cul-de-sac with his van, and he clicks the
clicker, and the alarm goes off on his van. He clicks the clicker, and the alarm keeps going. He clicks the
clicker, and it kept going, and the lights are going on in the street. I said to my daughter, "That was Jacob's
farewell. That was the last laugh he had on all of us." It was a tough moment.
Abby: Frank, as we kind of wrap up, what are some words of wisdom you would leave with us as we
think about how to navigate life, given the reality that death is, like you said, a 100 percent guarantee, and
given your experiences? What words you would you leave us with?
Frank: Well, I think one of the things to always realize is that around death, we have to be real. That
means we have to face the reality of it earlier in life. Even for somebody like you, Abby, I know that's a
hard thing because you're 28. You're going to live forever, right?
Abby: Nope. If I've learned anything…
Frank: You think you will.
Abby: There are days. There certainly are days.
Frank: I think even for folks who are younger, somewhere in our brains, we have to start thinking about
this. It comes back to the quality of our lives, the foundation of our lives. How we live day to day, I think,
has something to do with how we think we're going to die. There is so much value in life, and life is such
a precious gift. You realize it sometimes at the end, and I get to see it all the time.
When I'm with families toward the end or when I'm dealing with death, one of the things that always
comes to my mind is, "This is not about what we're taking away." Any service I've ever done, I have yet to
meet anyone whose service I've done who has taken something with them. Nobody takes anything away. I
sometimes stand in the cemetery and look around and go, "Everybody here left everything behind."
There's a great story of a gentleman who decided he wanted to be buried in his Mercedes. This is actually
one of the cemeteries here. The cemetery said, "Well, you can't do that." He decided he would take the
grill off of his Mercedes, and that would be his tombstone. Whenever I walk by that particular grave, I
always think, "That's humanity. That's what we think, that somehow, we're going to be connected."
We're not. None of us are going to take anything with us. It has to do with what we leave behind. What
are we leaving behind? The Psalms talk about that. There is a psalm that says, "Consider the works of my
hands. Yes, consider the works of my hands." That's Psalm 90:17. What that verse says is we want to have
some legacy. "I want to be remembered somehow."
© Menlo Park Presbyterian Church, All Rights Reserved
For personal or small group use only. For other uses, please contact [email protected].
-8-
How are we going to be remembered? It isn't by what we accomplish. It isn't about what we own. It isn't
about what we drive. It isn't about where we live. It isn't about what title we have. I think it has to do with
how we love, how we love God, how we love Jesus, how we love each other. Ultimately, it's all about
relationships, isn't it?
I mean, you think about just you and me and our friendship and our ability to talk about a subject that is
pretty complicated and pretty heavy. We're able to do that because we're considerate of each other. We
care for each other, right?
Abby: Yeah, absolutely.
Frank: I'm just asking because you weren't nodding. In the final analysis, it's about love.
© Menlo Park Presbyterian Church, All Rights Reserved
For personal or small group use only. For other uses, please contact [email protected].
-9-